DOS games & 3dfx voodoo - best version?

On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 09:32:34 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

Post by rpgs rock dvds
Any thoughts about which version of 3dfx voodoo to go for regarding
playing old DOS games? Browsing ebay, I've seen voodoo versions 1000,
2000, 3000, 4000, 5500. There may even be others.
I was thinking maybe 3000 might be a good mid-point card, but I don't
really want to pick up something that fails to work on some older
games.
There also seems to be a choice between AGP or PCI. My AGP slot is
filled ATM, so will go for PCI, but does it make a huge difference?

NO.

Post by rpgs rock dvds
Thanks, regards, Robert.

Hopefully you will be dual-booting Win 98 or earlier. Otherwise you
might as well run one of the Glide emulators... e.g Glidos.

If you still want to use XP, you might want to verify 3dfx driver
compatibility before getting a card. And you may be forced
to use some emulation anyway because of audio issues if you do not
happen to own a legacy audio card

I have a machine with SB16 and Voodoo 5 5500 that I can triple boot to
WinMe, Win 95 or 98 to play legacy titles. ( Actually the faithful
machine I have used for years for all my email and to read/post these
newsgroups)

A very few early Glide titles are not compatible with the V5.
And the V5 runs later Glide/ OpenGL titles just fine. However, the
PCI version of the 5500 is a very rare animal.

John Lewis

rpgs rock dvds

2008-03-01 22:15:37 UTC

Post by John Lewis
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 09:32:34 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

NO.

Post by rpgs rock dvds
Thanks, regards, Robert.

Hopefully you will be dual-booting Win 98 or earlier. Otherwise you
might as well run one of the Glide emulators... e.g Glidos.
If you still want to use XP, you might want to verify 3dfx driver
compatibility before getting a card. And you may be forced
to use some emulation anyway because of audio issues if you do not
happen to own a legacy audio card
I have a machine with SB16 and Voodoo 5 5500 that I can triple boot to
WinMe, Win 95 or 98 to play legacy titles. ( Actually the faithful
machine I have used for years for all my email and to read/post these
newsgroups)
A very few early Glide titles are not compatible with the V5.
And the V5 runs later Glide/ OpenGL titles just fine. However, the
PCI version of the 5500 is a very rare animal.
John Lewis

Thanks. I'm building a legacy machine with Win98. I say legacy, it's
actually a P4! I've just acquired a sound blaster live! card, and
hoping that this will provide satisfactory SB16 emulation in DOS. I
also want to play old games from that era that don't work too well in
XP. I have also built a new whizzy-speed PC with XP to run DOSBox!

Regarding my legacy PC, do you know if it's possible to have 2
graphics cards in it at the same time? My reasoning is - to have a
modern one running any windows games, and an older 3dfx voodoo card to
run the DOS stuff.

Regards, Robert.

John Lewis

2008-03-02 04:03:28 UTC

On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 14:15:37 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

Post by John Lewis
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 09:32:34 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

Post by rpgs rock dvds
Any thoughts about which version of 3dfx voodoo to go for regarding
playing old DOS games? =A0Browsing ebay, I've seen voodoo versions 1000,
2000, 3000, 4000, 5500. =A0There may even be others.
I was thinking maybe 3000 might be a good mid-point card, but I don't
really want to pick up something that fails to work on some older
games.
There also seems to be a choice between AGP or PCI. =A0My AGP slot is
filled ATM, so will go for PCI, but does it make a huge difference?

NO.

Post by rpgs rock dvds
Thanks, regards, Robert.

Hopefully you will be dual-booting Win 98 or earlier. Otherwise you
might as well run one of the Glide emulators... e.g Glidos.
If you still want to use XP, =A0you might want to verify 3dfx driver
compatibility before getting a card. And you may be forced
to use some emulation anyway because of audio issues if you do not
happen to own a legacy audio card
I have a machine with SB16 and Voodoo 5 5500 that I can triple boot to
WinMe, =A0Win 95 or 98 to play legacy titles. ( Actually the faithful
machine I have used for years for all my email =A0and to read/post these
newsgroups)
A very few early Glide titles are not compatible with the V5.
And the V5 runs later Glide/ OpenGL titles just fine. However, the
PCI version of the 5500 is a very rare animal.
John Lewis

It comes with legacy drivers that fully emulate SB16.

Post by rpgs rock dvds
I
also want to play old games from that era that don't work too well in
XP. I have also built a new whizzy-speed PC with XP to run DOSBox!
Regarding my legacy PC, do you know if it's possible to have 2
graphics cards in it at the same time? My reasoning is - to have a
modern one running any windows games, and an older 3dfx voodoo card to
run the DOS stuff.
Regards, Robert.

You should be able to run 1 AGP and 1 PCI video card, but you may have
to set the choice in BIOS.

John Lewis

Michael Cecil

2008-03-02 05:00:59 UTC

Post by John Lewis
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 14:15:37 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

Post by John Lewis
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 09:32:34 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

NO.

Post by rpgs rock dvds
Thanks, regards, Robert.

It comes with legacy drivers that fully emulate SB16.

You should be able to run 1 AGP and 1 PCI video card, but you may have
to set the choice in BIOS.
John Lewis

Yeah, also some cards will only work as the primary card. For instance
you might have a crappy old PCI card and intend for it to run a secondary
monitor but it might only work when it's the primary card. I think S3
cards were like that.

--
Michael Cecil
http://macecil.googlepages.com/index.htm

rpgs rock dvds

2008-03-02 09:15:40 UTC

Post by John Lewis
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 14:15:37 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

Post by John Lewis
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 09:32:34 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

NO.

Post by rpgs rock dvds
Thanks, regards, Robert.

It comes with legacy drivers that fully emulate SB16.

I
also want to play old games from that era that don't work too well in
XP. I have also built a new whizzy-speed PC with XP to run DOSBox!
Regarding my legacy PC, do you know if it's possible to have 2
graphics cards in it at the same time? My reasoning is - to have a
modern one running any windows games, and an older 3dfx voodoo card to
run the DOS stuff.
Regards, Robert.

You should be able to run 1 AGP and 1 PCI video card, but you may have
to set the choice in BIOS.
John Lewis- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

Re: 1 AGP + 1 PCI video card - that's the config I was going to go
for, but I've scoured the mobo manual, and cannot see a "graphics card
choice" option - which just so happens to be a choice in my newer asus
machine which is a little unfortunate I suppose as I don't need 2
cards in that box.

In any case, I think I'll go ahead and buy a 2nd pci legacy card
(3dfx) and just give it a go and see what happens - maybe I can
configure win98 to choose between cards or something, or at the very
worst, pull one of them out if I want to try some old dos glide
stuff. Many thanks, Robert.

John Lewis

2008-03-03 01:42:07 UTC

On Sun, 2 Mar 2008 01:15:40 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

Post by John Lewis
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 14:15:37 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

Post by John Lewis
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 09:32:34 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

Post by rpgs rock dvds
Any thoughts about which version of 3dfx voodoo to go for regarding
playing old DOS games? =3DA0Browsing ebay, I've seen voodoo versions 1=

000,

Post by rpgs rock dvds
2000, 3000, 4000, 5500. =3DA0There may even be others.
I was thinking maybe 3000 might be a good mid-point card, but I don't
really want to pick up something that fails to work on some older
games.
There also seems to be a choice between AGP or PCI. =3DA0My AGP slot i=

Post by rpgs rock dvds
filled ATM, so will go for PCI, but does it make a huge difference?

NO.

Post by rpgs rock dvds
Thanks, regards, Robert.

Hopefully you will be dual-booting Win 98 or earlier. Otherwise you
might as well run one of the Glide emulators... e.g Glidos.
If you still want to use XP, =3DA0you might want to verify 3dfx driver
compatibility before getting a card. And you may be forced
to use some emulation anyway because of audio issues if you do not
happen to own a legacy audio card
I have a machine with SB16 and Voodoo 5 5500 that I can triple boot to
WinMe, =3DA0Win 95 or 98 to play legacy titles. ( Actually the faithful=
machine I have used for years for all my email =3DA0and to read/post th=

ese

Post by John Lewis
newsgroups)
A very few early Glide titles are not compatible with the V5.
And the V5 runs later Glide/ OpenGL titles just fine. However, the
PCI version of the 5500 is a very rare animal.
John Lewis

Thanks. =A0I'm building a legacy machine with Win98. =A0I say legacy, it'=

actually a P4! =A0I've just acquired a sound blaster live! card, and
hoping that this will provide satisfactory SB16 emulation in DOS.

It comes with legacy drivers that fully emulate SB16.

=A0I
also want to play old games from that era that don't work too well in
XP. =A0I have also built a new whizzy-speed PC with XP to run DOSBox!
Regarding my legacy PC, do you know if it's possible to have 2
graphics cards in it at the same time? =A0My reasoning is - to have a
modern one running any windows games, and an older 3dfx voodoo card to
run the DOS stuff.
Regards, Robert.

You should be able to run 1 AGP and 1 PCI video card, but you may have
to set the choice in BIOS.
John Lewis- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

Re: 1 AGP + 1 PCI video card - that's the config I was going to go
for, but I've scoured the mobo manual, and cannot see a "graphics card
choice" option - which just so happens to be a choice in my newer asus
machine which is a little unfortunate I suppose as I don't need 2
cards in that box.
In any case, I think I'll go ahead and buy a 2nd pci legacy card
(3dfx) and just give it a go and see what happens - maybe I can
configure win98 to choose between cards or something, or at the very
worst, pull one of them out if I want to try some old dos glide
stuff. Many thanks, Robert.

WARNING:

If you intend to ever use a legacy AGP card.........

Many AGP1/2 cards have 3.3v drive levels and are NOT compatible with
modern motherboards. They can damage the motherboard circuitry. There
is keying in the AGP specs to prevent interfacing incompatible
hardware, but some videocards and/or motherboards ignore the keying.

If you have a AGP 4/8 motherboard, carefully check the video-card
specs for 1.5v compatibility.

See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accelerated_Graphics_Port

for an intro to the compatibility issues.

Do a google search under "AGP 1.5v 3.3v issues"
for more specific details.

John Lewis

rpgs rock dvds

2008-03-03 11:36:14 UTC

Post by John Lewis
On Sun, 2 Mar 2008 01:15:40 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

Post by John Lewis
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 14:15:37 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

Post by John Lewis
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 09:32:34 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

Post by rpgs rock dvds
Any thoughts about which version of 3dfx voodoo to go for regarding
playing old DOS games? =3DA0Browsing ebay, I've seen voodoo versions 1=

000,

Post by rpgs rock dvds
filled ATM, so will go for PCI, but does it make a huge difference?

NO.

Post by rpgs rock dvds
Thanks, regards, Robert.

ese

Thanks. =A0I'm building a legacy machine with Win98. =A0I say legacy, it'=

actually a P4! =A0I've just acquired a sound blaster live! card, and
hoping that this will provide satisfactory SB16 emulation in DOS.

It comes with legacy drivers that fully emulate SB16.

You should be able to run 1 AGP and 1 PCI video card, but you may have
to set the choice in BIOS.
John Lewis- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

Re: 1 AGP + 1 PCI video card - that's the config I was going to go
for, but I've scoured the mobo manual, and cannot see a "graphics card
choice" option - which just so happens to be a choice in my newer asus
machine which is a little unfortunate I suppose as I don't need 2
cards in that box.
In any case, I think I'll go ahead and buy a 2nd pci legacy card
(3dfx) and just give it a go and see what happens - maybe I can
configure win98 to choose between cards or something, or at the very
worst, pull one of them out if I want to try some old dos glide
stuff. Many thanks, Robert.

If you intend to ever use a legacy AGP card.........
Many AGP1/2 cards have 3.3v drive levels and are NOT compatible with
modern motherboards. They can damage the motherboard circuitry. There
is keying in the AGP specs to prevent interfacing incompatible
hardware, but some videocards and/or motherboards ignore the keying.
If you have a AGP 4/8 motherboard, carefully check the video-card
specs for 1.5v compatibility.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accelerated_Graphics_Port
for an intro to the compatibility issues.
Do a google search under "AGP 1.5v 3.3v issues"
for more specific details.
John Lewis- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

Phew, thanks a lot John - you may have just saved my mobo! I now need
to look for a PCI card!

It's interesting, early 3dfx PCI cards seem to have one notch cut in
their "mobo connector slot", and later ones appear to have 2. But I
don't see any mention of voltage incompatibility with PCI cards on the
net. Perhaps with PCI, this issue does not arise, even if they are
"keyed" with 1 notch or 2.

Thanks a lot, regards, Robert.

Greg Johnson

2008-03-01 22:17:26 UTC

On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 09:32:34 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

I never ran into any games that needed a 3dfx card that my Voodoo2
couldn't handle.

riku

2008-03-03 08:44:11 UTC

Post by John Lewis
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 09:32:34 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

I never ran into any games that needed a 3dfx card that my Voodoo2
couldn't handle.

Yep. That's because Glide-support in games was already waning when the
post-Voodoo2 cards appeared to the market.

riku

2008-03-03 08:41:21 UTC

On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 09:32:34 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

Probably 3Dfx Voodoo 2 with 12MB memory (some Voodoo 2 cards were with
8MB memory; they are probably ok as well). Original 3Dfx Voodoo (4MB
memory) has wide support coverage as well but will not perform as well
with newer Glide (or Direct3D) games. Naturally there is overlapping
in support, so most "Glide games" will work with both 3Dfx Voodoo and
Voodoo 2.

Voodoo 2 may give you trouble with _some_ early Glide games (made for
the first 3Dfx Voodoo) which seemed to be very finicky even about the
driver version you were using. E.g. Scorched Earth turned all graphics
blue if you didn't use old enough 3Dfx Voodoo drivers. There may have
been some workaround for that, copying old 3Dfx drivers to the game
directory etc.

Likewise, original Voodoo gave you problems with e.g. Heavy Gear (some
black boxes around the characters?), while Voodoo 2 or other 3D cards
didn't have the same problem. However, I think Heavy Gear was a
Direct3D game anyway, maybe with separate support for also Glide and
some other proprietary 3D cards (Rendition Verite?).

Post by rpgs rock dvds
I was thinking maybe 3000 might be a good mid-point card, but I don't
really want to pick up something that fails to work on some older
games.

3Dfx Glide-supporting games were specifically made for either 4MB
Voodoo, or later the 8MB/12MB Voodoo 2 cards.

Post by rpgs rock dvds
There also seems to be a choice between AGP or PCI. My AGP slot is
filled ATM, so will go for PCI, but does it make a huge difference?

Glide-games were made in the era of PCI 3Dfx cards. When later Voodoo
3000 cards etc. game to market, Direct3D and OpenGL already prevailed
over Glide.

rpgs rock dvds

2008-03-03 11:40:47 UTC

Post by John Lewis
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 09:32:34 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

Probably 3Dfx Voodoo 2 with 12MB memory (some Voodoo 2 cards were with
8MB memory; they are probably ok as well). Original 3Dfx Voodoo (4MB
memory) has wide support coverage as well but will not perform as well
with newer Glide (or Direct3D) games. Naturally there is overlapping
in support, so most "Glide games" will work with both 3Dfx Voodoo and
Voodoo 2.
Voodoo 2 may give you trouble with _some_ early Glide games (made for
the first 3Dfx Voodoo) which seemed to be very finicky even about the
driver version you were using. E.g. Scorched Earth turned all graphics
blue if you didn't use old enough 3Dfx Voodoo drivers. There may have
been some workaround for that, copying old 3Dfx drivers to the game
directory etc.
Likewise, original Voodoo gave you problems with e.g. Heavy Gear (some
black boxes around the characters?), while Voodoo 2 or other 3D cards
didn't have the same problem. However, I think Heavy Gear was a
Direct3D game anyway, maybe with separate support for also Glide and
some other proprietary 3D cards (Rendition Verite?).

Post by rpgs rock dvds
I was thinking maybe 3000 might be a good mid-point card, but I don't
really want to pick up something that fails to work on some older
games.

3Dfx Glide-supporting games were specifically made for either 4MB
Voodoo, or later the 8MB/12MB Voodoo 2 cards.

Post by rpgs rock dvds
There also seems to be a choice between AGP or PCI. My AGP slot is
filled ATM, so will go for PCI, but does it make a huge difference?

Glide-games were made in the era of PCI 3Dfx cards. When later Voodoo
3000 cards etc. game to market, Direct3D and OpenGL already prevailed
over Glide.

Thanks a lot riku. Would you advise steering clear of voodoo 3 cards
in general, for potential compatibility issues with older games?

Best regards, Robert.

riku

2008-03-03 13:53:53 UTC

On Mon, 3 Mar 2008 03:40:47 -0800 (PST), rpgs rock dvds

Post by rpgs rock dvds
Thanks a lot riku. Would you advise steering clear of voodoo 3 cards
in general, for potential compatibility issues with older games?

Frankly, I am not familiar with post-Voodoo 2 cards (I've owned 4MB
3Dfx Voodoo and 12MB Voodoo 2, and after them upgraded to 64MB ATI
Radeon series). I presume their compatibility should be quite good
with Glide games, but I have no idea what issues they might or might
not have with Voodoo 4MB era DOS Glide games, for example. Some of the
old Glide games seemed to be a bit finicky.

One option is also to use Glide wrappers with non-3Dfx cards.

noman

2008-03-03 22:55:48 UTC